ASM Mini G and MagDrive 9

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KidNano

New Member
I just bought an ASM Mini G skimmer and a MagDrive 950 for a 60 gallon with a +/-20 gallon sump. does anyone have any opinions on these two particular items? With 7 feet of line attached to the Mag Drive it will drop to about 600 GPH. I'll post later with pictures of how I'm setting this tank up. But for now I'm just curious about these two products.

Thanks for any input that anyone might have.
 
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Trogdor

New Member
The Mag-Drive 9.5, IMO, is a pretty good pump. I've been running it on my 29g in a closed loop setup for about 2 months now without issues. Just be sure not to overtighten the connections on the pump. I cracked the pump cover when I installed it the first time. If you are using PVC, did you take into account the elbows adding additional head loss?
 
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KidNano

New Member
The LFS said he thought the 950 would be plenty of flow for my tank. I am concerned about losing flow for sure. I might return it and upgrade to the 1250. how would you rate the flow on your 29. that seems like an enormous amount of flow for 29. what do I know though. I'm new.

I haven't done the plumbing yet. I'm still considering PVC but was planning on using the flex tube. or combining the two. what are your thoughts on that?

I'll make sure I don't over tighten. Thanks.
 
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Trogdor

New Member
'm running approximately 1200-1300gph throughout my entire tank. I'm estimating that I'm getting about 800gph through my MD pump. In a closed-loop setup there is no head pressure so I'm not loosing any flow that way. Most of my flow loss is through the flex tubing that I used. Parts of it are slightly deformed so they end up more oval then round. If you can find some really rigid flexible tubing (i know that's an oxymoron) then you will get more flow out of it.

I have a 29g tall tank and I use a spray bar to push water down the back of my tank and towards the front. I have a MJ 600, AquaClear PH 302 (I believe) and a Magnum HOT filter...combined with the MD pump it's pushing towards 1200-1300gph. Is it too much? I can't say for sure. My xenia is growing like a weed and is at the bottom of my tank. It doesn't get blown around too bad but there are random bursts of flow that push the polyps in every direction. The water flow does get slower at the bottom of the tank but it does circulate and move debris around on the sand bed. (the sand doesn't blow everywhere either)

Going with the 1250 might not be a bad idea, it really depends on what you want to do with your tank. Personally I like a lot of flow and with this setup it works rather well.
 
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KidNano

New Member
one thing that confuses me. The pumps come with a 3/4" head on them, but they reccomend you use 1-1/2" piping for maximum flow. I can't decide if I want the bigger pump. It's only $40 more and could help prevent me from having to get a tunze or somthing in the future if I do want more flow but at the same time I don't think I want that much flow through my sump and fuge.

The drain lines from my tank are 2 x 1" ID flex but I'm using all hard lined PVC for my return. I managed to only use one 90 degree elbow. The rest are all 45's.

I have a bunch of questions about my set up so I think I'm going to start my new tanks thread this weekend complete with photos and all. Get as many opinions as possible. Keep an I out in the "not quite nano" forum. Thanks for your thoughts on the pump. I'll let you know what I decide to do. I want to have this thing finished by the end of the weekend.
 
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Trogdor

New Member
Here's a link to the Danner Supreme website to find info about the pumps.

http://www.pondmaster.com/infoS.asp#

Although it does mention that they use a 3/4NPT threaded male and female adaption, it doesn't mention the Ø1.5" pipe recommendation to get the most flow. In fact, I would almost suggest not going larger diameter than the outlet on your pipe because it will just cause more turbulence and increase the load on the pump. Thus increasing your head pressure because you now have more water volume that the pump has to push upward to counter the gravitational force.

This is just my opinion but here's food for thought. If you want to have a lot of flow but not necessarily through you sump/fuge then why not setup both; a sump/fuge and a closed-loop system. A closed-loop setup just takes water in from one side and pushes it out another, all inlet and outlet tubes are in the main display. You could then setup a sump/fuge with a lower flow pump so that you aren't pushing 1200gph through your fuge and still have enough flow in your main display. I dunno what you really are trying to achieve in this tank so the best I can do is speculate and offer suggestions. Hope some of this helps and let us know what you plan on doing. Good luck.
 
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reefman23

New Member
Trogdor said:
Here's a link to the Danner Supreme website to find info about the pumps.

http://www.pondmaster.com/infoS.asp#

Although it does mention that they use a 3/4NPT threaded male and female adaption, it doesn't mention the Ø1.5" pipe recommendation to get the most flow. In fact, I would almost suggest not going larger diameter than the outlet on your pipe because it will just cause more turbulence and increase the load on the pump. Thus increasing your head pressure because you now have more water volume that the pump has to push upward to counter the gravitational force.
Click to expand...
Actually, it is true that a larger diam return line will give you much more flow. Use the head loss calculator on www.reefcentral.com... http://www.reefcentral.com/calc/hlc2.php


A Mag 9 (it doesnt have the 9.5 listed) at just a straight 4 foot head:
  • with 3/4" return line= 704 GPH
  • with 1 1/4" return line= 802 GPH
You wouldnt want to go with a 1 1/2" return line on that pump because it will only give you a wopping 7 gph more!

I use a 1 1/2" return line on my QuietOne 4000 and it really helps it out because it uses half as many watts as the comparable Mag so as a result it suffers a lot more head loss.

HTH,

Jesse
 
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Trogdor

New Member
you're right. i went back to the Danner pdf and found the line that says to use atleast a Ø1.5" hose for maximum flow. Any idea on how to find the flow in a closed-loop setup? I would like to know how much flow that I'm actually pumping through this pump. It's the mag 9.5 btw.

thx
 
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KidNano

New Member
Well I learned how not to build a sump the hard way. About 15 gallons worth of the hard way. I think I'm going to buy one. :sad:

As far as the pump.... I think I'm going to keep it. I have two one inch drain lines and they have a hard time keeping up with it. I've got to make some adjustments to them and I'm giving some thought to running two systems like you suggested Trogdor. One closed loop and an open drain into my sump with a return pump.

For now I just need to get my carpet dried, figure out how to get the salt out of it and figure out how to make this up to my wife. Of course only I would destroy my wife's home while she's 8 months pregnant and nesting. Wow :oops:
 
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KidNano

New Member
one thought. :?: I used a 3/4" run from the pump to the top of my tank Then I used 1" line and created a loop on top with four heads coming down into the tank. My thought was that it takes a lot less energy to push water vertically through a 3/4" then a 1" or bigger line. Therefore possibly losing less flow. Then when it gets up there I've got the bigger line to allow more flow. I don't know much about physics, but this seemed to make sense to me and the tank was filling up really quickly during my trial run. I tested it in my bath tub too and there was a lot of flow. I guess it's a question of what's more restrictive. the 3/4" line or the weight of the extra volume in the 1" or 1-1/4".

Thoughts?
 
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KidNano

New Member
that link is awesome. I guess I'll swap out my 3/4" riser with a 1-1/4". Thanks.

The Sump? Well I'm pretty handy with DIY stuff so I thought I'd give it a whirl. I did a little research online to see how people have built them out of Acrylic. I guess most people use the weldon 4 stuff. All of my tools are up at my Cabin in Big Bear so I thought I would use the little knife tool and use silicone instead, because my cuts weren't going to be clean enough with out my saw and router. I bought the Lexicon stuff that is sold right there next to the acrylic saying it creates the best bond for Plexi and Acrylic.

So I took my time with it to try to get the best cuts and the best bond possible. yesterday I was finished and everything was dry. I filled it about half way and put my pump in to check out the flow. The pump was producing too much and my 2 one inch drains could keep up with it. couldn't figure out why. so I turned off the pump so the tank wouldn't overflow and took off Babies R us and to my LFS (Coral Oasis). I went home to figure out why my drain lines weren't working and there was still no sign of any problems with the sump. I turned the elbows on my drains side ways to get more water and less air in the drain tube. Ran the pump for about 10 minutes and the drains were working much better. then I took one of the elbows off to cut some lines in it. When I was putting it back on the tank I heard a ruch of water and my feet were soaked. I looked down and the bottom corner in the sump gave way. A night mare is all I can say. Luckily my wife wasn't home and I got the swimming pool cleaned up called her and told her to stay at her mom's. She came home with Ice cream and took it like a champ, although I haven't heard from her all day.

That's the story of an ignorant man trying to save a buck. :oops: I'm going to by a premade sump tonight. Thanks for reading. Don't try this at home.
 
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KidNano

New Member
I bought a 20L to use for my sump. The carpet is dried, shampooed and tacked back down with the tank back in place. tomorrow I'm going to finish all the plumbing and fill it back up. I'll start my thread for the tank this weekend. Tried to last night, but I was having internet trouble at home.
 
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