Damn Damsel!

[Krystin]

Hi everyone...
I am having trouble feeding my new orange tube coral "it must be fed vitamin-enriched brine shrimp or micro-plankton from an eye dropper directly to each one of its polyps." The problem is that my Damsel won't leave us alone and keeps stealing the food out of their little mouths :cry: . He doesn't get nervous about my hand or the dropper, he is very pushy!
Any ideas? Maybe the Damsel needs to go?
Thanks!
Krystin
P.S. Will it bother my zoanthids or tube coral that my hermit crabs keep crawling all over them and poking them... or is that just natural?

 

[cadeucsb]

damsels are always a pain in the ass, they can be mean and territorial as well... i had to remove one because it wouldnt leave my cleaner shrimp alone. If you do decide to get rid of it, set some time aside because they are a major pain to catch...took me about 10min to catch one in my 2.5g.

 

[mikeguerrero]

Hi Kristin,

A simple solution to your problem is feed first the damsel. There is a point that the damsel will not accept any more food. When you get to this point, you will see that he will not attempt to steal the food from an attempt to feed the coral.

Give it a try, I've seen many try this method and it works.

Good luck,

Mike

 

[Krystin]

I have been feeding the Damsel first, but it sounds like you're saying I could just feed it MORE until it stops going after food? I was afraid of overfeeding. I'll tell you what I've been feeding it.... Usually about 3 of those little balls of New Life Spectrum all-purpose (3 x per day), and I also feed it Ocean Nutrition Brine Shrimp Plus flakes maybe a little once a day and some frozen brine shrimp every once in awhile as a treat. I am really just kind-of trying to guess how much to give him because the directions are not specific as to how much one fish can eat. The Spectrum balls have to be given to him one at a time or else he loses them so I can't do the "amount consumed within 2 minutes trick. I am buying what they tell me at the LFS and I am not sure how much to trust them yet.
So, my question after all of that is: Am I feeding it the right kinds of foods and am I feeding it enough? Should I give it a bunch of brine shrimp before I feed the corals?
Thanks!
~Krystin

 

[cadeucsb]

IMO... if its not easy, messing with over feeding might be asking for trouble when talking about a $5 fish... but you could really like the fish and thus making any effort worth it. Just be careful with overfeeding, if he doesnt eat it all, it could snowball into other issues.

 

[mikeguerrero]

Kristen,

Small increments that he can eat is all you need to do. Don't just dump in large portions and have him pick at that. It's time consumming but it will work.

Variety of fish food is good, but you should try to flake food it's easy, not messy and works wonders for fish to fill up.

Once you are done seeing that he just doesn't pursue the food anymore, stop feeding. The portion that remains in the tank could go to the cleaner crew.

Okay pull out your syriange and spot feed your coral. You should have no interuption at this point from the damsel.

If he doesn't stop pestering, you need to get rid of him. It's not worth losing a coral for a two dollar fish IMOP.....

Mike

 

[djconn]

I agree completely. I would never risk my corals to a damsel. That is why I don't have any in my tanks. They are also very aggressive and territorial.

Good luck with it!

 

[Krystin]

I agree, I am not willing to let a fish control the tank. I will try what you've suggested and let you know how it goes.
Could you look at the P.S. on my original post and reply to that, plz?
Thanks,
Krystin

 

[mikeguerrero]

Krystin,

Regarding your zoos I can answer but tube coral, I don't have one so I cannot comment.

Your zoos will be okay, hermit crabs by nature are scavengers and have clumsy shells that they pull around. As they crawl around in search of food they will cause a zoo to retract.

But you will see as the hermit finally decides to move the zoo will flower back up.

The only time it's bad is if your ratio of hermit crabs is too high for your tank. That means that as one hermit leaves the other follows and does the same on your zoo. End result is the zoo can starve to death because of stress and lack of nutrient flow.

So for the most part you should be okay, I hate it when my hermits are all over my zoos on a day of a contest and I'm photographing the tank. I have to wait for them to move and get out of the way for the polpys to re-extend.

But I cannot live without my little hermits because they do a lot of cleanning. I would just make sure you get the tiny ones because they do the most work and are not as clumsy as the larger one.

Big ones are lazy and refuse to work, they sometimes will become a bully.

Mike

 

[dragon79]

Krystin,

Regarding your zoos I can answer but tube coral, I don't have one so I cannot comment.

Your zoos will be okay, hermit crabs by nature are scavengers and have clumsy shells that they pull around. As they crawl around in search of food they will cause a zoo to retract.

But you will see as the hermit finally decides to move the zoo will flower back up.

The only time it's bad is if your ratio of hermit crabs is too high for your tank. That means that as one hermit leaves the other follows and does the same on your zoo. End result is the zoo can starve to death because of stress and lack of nutrient flow.

So for the most part you should be okay, I hate it when my hermits are all over my zoos on a day of a contest and I'm photographing the tank. I have to wait for them to move and get out of the way for the polpys to re-extend.

But I cannot live without my little hermits because they do a lot of cleanning. I would just make sure you get the tiny ones because they do the most work and are not as clumsy as the larger one.

Big ones are lazy and refuse to work, they sometimes will become a bully.

Mike

I guess hermits at a stage of their life retire as well, haha. May not get paid, but he sits on his ass loving it.

 

[incysor]

Depending on how large the coral is you can make a feeding 'cap' by cutting the bottom off a plastic soda bottle then you can put the bottle over the coral squirt the food inside it and the fish can't really get to it. It keeps the current from carrying the food away before the polyps can grab it as well. I did this for a while with my sun polyps, then I just got lazy and moved them to a low flow area of the tank. I put a bit of cyclopeeze in the water column, when the coral senses it, and extends it's polyps I then spray them directly with the rest. Lots of folks say that sun polyps are nocturnal, but mine come out about the same time each day now that they're used to me feeding this way, it's only about half way through the photoperiods on my tanks.

B

 

[Krystin]

Incysor,
I have only had my sun polyps for a couple of days, I am including a photo, not all of the polyps have opened. From the picture, can you tell, are they fully extended? You mentioned feeding Cyclopeeze, can I feed Marine Snow? What do people think of Marine Snow? Several questions here.
~Krystin

[/img]

 

[incysor]

Incysor,
I have only had my sun polyps for a couple of days, I am including a photo, not all of the polyps have opened. From the picture, can you tell, are they fully extended? You mentioned feeding Cyclopeeze, can I feed Marine Snow? What do people think of Marine Snow? Several questions here.
~Krystin

It may take awhile to get them to all fully open. You just want to wait until they're extended a bit to feed, because spraying them down with food before the polyps are extended is a waste. You may have to wait a bit after the lights are off. It took me a couple weeks to 'train' mine to come out when the cyclopeeze hit the water. They respond better to it than anything else I've tried. Marine snow WILL NOT work for this coral. It is not a filter feeding coral, and marine snow is simply too fine, and not enough food for it. It needs meatier more substantial foods. Mysis, krill, finely-chopped silversides, cyclopeeze, etc...

B

Here's a link with some good info.

http://www.melevsreef.com/pics/0604/suncoral.html

Here's a couple pics of my sun polyps.

 

[Krystin]

Incysor,
Thanks, the links were helpful. Yours look very nice! Last night, more of mine opened (I think all of them) and I was able to feed at least some of them. However, the Damsel still bothered us a lot even though I had fed it plenty. It would come over and take their food and then go spit it out somewhere else. So, he'll probably go back to the store soon.
I'll look for cyclopeeze too but, it sounds like it isn't always easy to get.
Thanks again,
Krystin

 

[mikeguerrero]

Krystin,

After reading your post, get rid of the Damsel. He has become a bully.

Mike

 

[dragon79]

Incysor,
Thanks, the links were helpful. Yours look very nice! Last night, more of mine opened (I think all of them) and I was able to feed at least some of them. However, the Damsel still bothered us a lot even though I had fed it plenty. It would come over and take their food and then go spit it out somewhere else. So, he'll probably go back to the store soon.
I'll look for cyclopeeze too but, it sounds like it isn't always easy to get.
Thanks again,
Krystin

Hopefully you find cyclopeeze, because it looks like a giant candy bar in a red package. It's great because a little bit goes a long way. My fish, corals, inverts love it.

to incysor: isn't there a type of sun coral that looks just like yours but opens during the day? I forget the name and I saw some supposably at a frag swap, I wouldn't know what the difference was as they look the same to me. Of course this special one costs hundreds of dollars to obtain.

 

[incysor]

Incysor,
Thanks, the links were helpful. Yours look very nice! Last night, more of mine opened (I think all of them) and I was able to feed at least some of them. However, the Damsel still bothered us a lot even though I had fed it plenty. It would come over and take their food and then go spit it out somewhere else. So, he'll probably go back to the store soon.
I'll look for cyclopeeze too but, it sounds like it isn't always easy to get.
Thanks again,
Krystin

Hopefully you find cyclopeeze, because it looks like a giant candy bar in a red package. It's great because a little bit goes a long way. My fish, corals, inverts love it.

to incysor: isn't there a type of sun coral that looks just like yours but opens during the day? I forget the name and I saw some supposably at a frag swap, I wouldn't know what the difference was as they look the same to me. Of course this special one costs hundreds of dollars to obtain.

LOL...I've never heard of one. Sounds like a bullsh*tter to me.
The thing is these corals aren't really photsynthetic, so day/night doesn't seem to mean much to them. In the wild they prefer shady areas on the reef, and depending on how shady they may be open during the day. My lights come on at 3-4pm, and go off at 11-midnight. My sunpolyps now open about 8 or so, because that's near the time I normally feed.

B

 

[dragon79]

hey b:

i found this on ebay. This is it. It kind of looks like the sun coral.

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?Vi ... otohosting

Dendrophyllia coral

Looks just like in the picture that you gave melev website.
http://www.melevsreef.com/pics/0704/suncoral_071704.jpg

These are two diff types of coral right? or is it a crock and what people are selling are actual sun coral? Would be a b*tch to be fooled...look at the price he says you would be paying at LFS...1200, sheesh I dont think so....too pricey, that's insane.

 

[incysor]

They're very similar critters....

Distinguishing Characteristics
These types of coral do not contain symbiotic zooxanthellae in their tissues, and their red to deep purple appearance is solely due to their own pigments. Not requiring light for food energy, these corals populate the roofs and walls of caves or under ledges where other hard corals will not survive. They obtain their energy solely by feeding on zooplankton, and the sight of their large, colorful polyps and tentacles expanded for feeding can be spectacular. They grow as either solitary or small branching forms and therefore are not reef-forming, and their skeletons are light and porous. Members of these and related groups can occur in very deep and cold water throughout the world, unlike the reef-forming corals which are primarily restricted to the tropics in warm sunlit water.

Species of Dendrophyllia are often differentiated from Tubastrea in the field on the basis of the smaller size of their calyces and by a greater tendency for branching and forming arborescent colonies. However, these are unreliable charactersistics for accurate identification. since some Dendrophyllia grow as small clumps similar to Tubastrea. Also, both types may occur in a variety of colors. although Tubastrea is inaccurately considered to be primarily red. The two genera can be differentiated from the structure of the septa of their cleaned skeletons. In Dendrophyllia,the calyces follow the Pourtales Plan wherein the septa fuse in groups of three together at the center of the calyx. Tubastrea conversely shows no central fusion of the septa.

Habitat
Tubastrea sp. is found under conditions of reduced or no light under ledges or in caves on or at the base of steep slopes. It can usually be found in intermediate to deep depths, but can occur in shallow water where right conditions are reduced.


Found here:
http://www.bishopmuseum.org/research/pb ... drophyllia

 

[Krystin]

Incysor-That's so funny, I was just about to post the same quote from bishopmuseum before I read your reply. Glad I didn't, I'd feel pretty stupid!

So, everyone, my Damsel went back to the store last night. I kind of feel sad, but I know it will be worth it. Maybe I could've spent more time letting the damsel get used to my new feeding habits, but, honestly, I don't have that kind of time in my life.
Thanks for all of your advice.
~Krystin